09.24.07
…regarding Margaret Karmizin’s story
The author of the story I posted earlier today and I have been having a discussion I thought you all might find interesting. I asked her to send it as a comment directly to this blog, but she prefers I just put it up myself. Parts of our discussion appear below:
Karmazin: I wish I were Stage 4, but alas, the signs aren’t there yet. I think a Stage 4 person would be filled with love and much nicer than I am!
MPJ: Ah! But we can’t equate these belief stages with goodness of behavior (niceness) - or at least I am not trying to! I am trying to only refer to belief. That is something I am afraid of - that people will think I am rating people with regard to their goodness or worth as a human being - which I would not even attempt to do in such a cursory way!
I do think your belief level is stage four - though of course I don’t presume to know anything at all about your level of morality. I was hoping my readers could see the difference. What do you think?
Karmazin: I was wondering that - if someone who reaches stage 4 is more “good.” You would think that having a more constant flow with God would automatically reflect in one’s behavior. If a person, as, say A Course in Miracles promotes, forgives everyone and sees Christ in every other person, to follow in oneself (this would definitely be a Stage 4 state of being), then automatically, I would think, one would behave in a more advanced manner. Not out of fear or doing one’s duty as would a Stage 2, but just out of plain love and joy. A Stage 3 person could behave quite awfully, as could a Stage 1 or Stage 2 (they would do it in the name of God), but it’s hard for me to imagine a Stage 4 doing that. I would like to hear people’s opinions on this idea… I read my piece at our writers group today and got a discussion going. They maintained that someone could move to Stage 3 and then return to 2, like if their mother dies and they are suffering a guilt complex or something, and I maintained that this person might go back to 2 but wouldn’t remain there. Another thing to discuss if you like. I would venture to say that my level is Stage 3 with one toe in Stage 4.
MPJ: I would say that is just about where I am too. But while I consider myself a very moral person I would be loathe to connect that with my stage of belief. I think I was just as moral when I was absolutely in stage 3 and probably no less so as a stage two - IF I ever really was in that stage for real. Interesting how we both seem so interested in this topic and both feel we are in the same stage.
…So how about it? Any readers care to comment? 1- Are the belief stages tied to morality and goodness of behavior? 2) can people backslide - revert to a former stage once they have moved beyond that?
I am delighted you brought the concept to your writing group! And that they could grasp the concept enough to discuss it! This is a large part of doing the blog. I am trying to see if the concept is something people can grasp and would be interested in.